Thoughts while reading

[macklingirl]

Did you ever have the feeling of betrayal while reading a Pros-story? I mean the feeling you have when you realise that the summary of the very long story has unfortunately been the best part of the story.

The story has more than 43000 words and the summary says "A man from Bodie's past seeks revenge, he wants Bodie dead but first he wants him to suffer like he as. Can CI5 save him before John Morgan get his wish and kills him",  so I thought "Wonderful. That could be a good h/c Bodie story." And I wanted to know why this John Morgan wants to kill Bodie. So I started reading.

But after the second chapter I had to stop for a while. I couldn't find out if the author is a native speaker or not, but I really, really wish she would have had a beta reader for her story. It seems as if the whole story was translated via google translator. There are never-ending sentences without any comma, some seem like three sentences in one. And there are lots and lots of missing letters and sometimes, for me, the whole sentence doesn't make sense.

And then I've read the reviews and they all say "Wow, what a great story." or "Very well written" and so on. So I think, maybe it is only me who has the problems and maybe it is because I'm not a native speaker. Or am I too spoiled by our authors? I mean, we have really very good authors writing the Big Bang stories or stories for the DIALJ challenges.

I'm curious how the story will end (at the moment Bodie is alive and six feet under in a coffin), but I must admit I'm happy when I reach the end and can read something better written.

For all who are interested, the link is under the cut.


For all who are interested: R-for-Revenge

Comments

[byslantedlight.livejournal.com]

Ah, it's Fanfiction.net — I must admit I never read over there, because I've yet to find well-written stories there (not to say there aren't any, I just haven't found them in my brief searches *g*) And it also looks like it's gen.

From a brief glance — yes, the author could definitely do with a beta reader, and my guess is that they're native-English speakers, but have never specialised in English. But they also say it's their first Bodie and Doyle story, and my impression is that people tend to post to fanfiction.net when they don't have Pros contacts/aren't in the lj Pros communities etc., so I'd guess they just don't know about beta readers to start with. I didn't, when I was first writing Pros, it's just that I happened upon Pros on lj, where expectations were made pretty clear.

One of my favourite Pros writers had similar issues with their first drafts of stories, but it was just issues with writing rather than anything else, and a thorough edit sorted it out. Their ideas and characterisation etc. were brilliant, it was just the grammar that was problematic.

I'm still working, so can't read any more now, but I might try later if I can...

[macklingirl.livejournal.com]

Yes, it is one from Fanfiction.net. There are some stories I like even that they are gen. One of the stories I like there is DONNA-THE-ANGOLA-YEARS by Elzy.

But they have 12600 beta reader at Fanfiction.net. And all of them tell you in their beta-bio what strength they have and for which fandom they'll beta. So I think if one would seek help she or he could find it there.

I think I'm mostly so confused because I always thought that my grammar and writing must be much worse than that of a native-English speaker. Maybe she writes like she speaks and that's a reason why I get more disturbed by the faults.

Thank you for your explanation.

[byslantedlight.livejournal.com]

But they have 12600 beta reader at Fanfiction.net. And all of them tell you in their beta-bio what strength they have and for which fandom they'll beta. So I think if one would seek help she or he could find it there.
I've just been to have a look at this, and I have no idea how someone would find a beta for Pros from the massive list of people who come up - it looks like you have to go into each person's profile to see what they beta for. I couldn't see a filter by fandom (maybe I just didn't see it).

The other thing is that if you don't know you need a beta (or know what a beta is — and I didn't when I started writing for Pros) then you wouldn't go looking for someone. You'd think your story was fine. I mean, if you wrote a story in German, and had never heard of beta readers, would you think of getting someone to correct it for you before posting? Or would you assume that your German writing was fine? *g*

I don't think it looks quite like writing-as-someone-speaks, I think it's just not having internalised various "rules" for writing, and so not applying them. And we learn English differently to the way non-native speakers learn it too, so you probably have a better knowledge of English rules etc. than alot of us (this is something I noticed when I was teaching English as a second language years ago. And the way English is taught is different in the UK and US as well, quite apart from the differences between those languages themselves! It's all very tricksy and interesting... *g*

And then you get into the difference between not just written and spoken English, and all the various dialects, but the little twists of phraseology that make a real difference to the way we read something as fiction rather than non-fiction etc... *g*

It's not just fanfiction.net though — there are Pros stories on A03 and in the older archives that are written in ways I just can't read (and as Gilda says, sometimes there's all sorts of fabulous feedback for these stories too, when I want to cringe at the sentence structure, or dialogue, or punctuation... and that's not even starting on the characterisation... *vbg*

[macklingirl.livejournal.com]

This is one of the sentences which lead me to the idea that it might be a non-native-English writer. That sounds like something that happens when you use google translator. It can't work with the name Bodie as a name.

>Once down on the other side Mike gathered their bags while Morgan retied the Bodie's hands together, this time they were behind his back.<

Or would you assume that your German writing was fine?
No, of course I wouldn't assume that. It was a terrible thing. But I really didn't know anyone who wrote stories. I could write poems at that time (and I still can) and they are good. So it doesn't feel too wrong for me. And there aren't so many German stories to tell the difference.

...so you probably have a better knowledge of English rules etc. than a lot of us

My old English teacher would laugh himself sick if he could read this. I was the worst pupil ever in English. I didn't understand it and I never thought about reading anything in English again after I finished school. But today I'm sure that it was only because I didn't have the right thing to read. *g*

[heliophile-oxon.livejournal.com]

Just had a very quick glance at the fic (hi bsl, hi macklingirl! hope you're keeping well!)

Like bsl, I practically never read on fanfiction.net; the few times I did, sadly I didn't find much decent writing there. And I agree: this is probably a native speaker, but someone who perhaps doesn't have much experience with composition.

Not really my cup of tea, as it's gen and I usually prefer slash with few exceptions, but from the (admittedly very little) bit I read I would definitely agree that nobody really seems in character to me.

Let us be spoiled by our good authors! *g*

[macklingirl.livejournal.com]

Hi helio. Great to see you. Well, sometimes you can find a good one.

And yes, non of our CI5 characters really is in character in this story. I mean, Cowley wouldn't yell at Murphy for losing Bodie after he (Murphy) was knocked out with a gun. And Doyle wouldn't be able to leave the hospital on his own two feet after surgery to fix his broken rips.

There are so many inconsistencies there.

[tinturtle]

But they also say it's their first Bodie and Doyle story, and my impression is that people tend to post to fanfiction.net when they don't have Pros contacts/aren't in the lj Pros communities etc., so I'd guess they just don't know about beta readers to start with.

I think some people are too shy to ask, also. If you hadn't offered to look over my first fanfic, it's entirely possible it wouldn't have been beta read at all.

[macklingirl.livejournal.com]

Yeah, you might be right and that she really is too shy. She didn't write any other story so maybe someone told her about the problems and she didn't like the reaction. We'll never know for sure.